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History's Hinge - 'Ain Jalut

[bahamawrecker]

What could this be?
At present all I want to say, is that this artifact comes from a ship wreck. If I give more information, it might bias the responses.
The artifact is made of bronze or brass.
The identity of the artifact, its purpose and use could give me very useful information about this unidentified shipwreck itself.
Bahamawrecker

[Jesus of Lubeck]

B-Wrecker,

Another very interesting, very curious artifact: generally the artifact gives every appearance of being a triangular form copper/brass/bronze priming flask, perhaps for a pistol. There are several ornate examples of pocket priming flasks; however, I have not found any that match the decorative technique found on your piece yet. The boxy form and side ring mounts (if I am interpreting the photo correctly) are of a style favored by German and Dutch musket or wheel lock armed professionals; however, the decoration is not necessarily European. This is not as specific a follow up as I would like and is rather tenuous.  Nevertheless, it may move the discussion forward.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Bart]

Bahama;

The squares below the rim, on either side tend to indicate the object was hung or held upright from them. Presuming the top piece is a lid, is it a hinged lid? Is the object cast, soldered from stamped halves, or hammered? What is the inside like, a large drilled hole, or ? Dimensions? Weight? Priming flask sounds very reasonable to me.

Bart

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello B-Wrecker, Bart, and the HH forum,

Here is a second post on the possible priming flask artifact, this time focusing on the puzzling aspects of the objects decorative motifs.  First let me say that the search for an exact match in the form and motif of B-Wrecker�s possible priming flask has not yet achieved a satisfactory conclusion; however, some lines of further investigation have presented themselves.

It has already been noted that the decorative motif on the brass is not necessarily European; the design lacks the mythological hunting and battle motifs found in great frequency on European designs.  Also of note, while there is a suggestion of Arabic or Islamic influence in the arrangement of the design and its complete lack of representation of the human figure, unlike many Islamic motifs, this design lacks any stylized Koranic script.   

Working from the premise that the decorative motif is floral and the artifact is associated with firearms and therefore warfare or hunting, the survey led into cultures where floral motifs are found expressed on military objects.  In this regard, there is a very strong association between lotus imagery and weapons in Buddhist and Hindu India.  The representation of lotus imagery on weapons from the Indian subcontinent reached a particularly popular phase during the reign of the Moghul emperors (1526-1857).

Thus I would advance the hypothesis that the possible priming flask is perhaps decorated in a stylized lotus motif.  This decoration, coinciding as it does on an object associated with a black powder firearm (perhaps), could fall into a date range from, say 1556 CE to 1707 CE when Moghul Rule was at the zenith of its influence (I presume B-Wrecker has a precise range for the date of the object).

After the reign of Jahangir (1605-1628), Moghul culture progressively found itself Indianized. During the last half of the 17th century, Hindu craftsmen, and other non-Muslim artisans, were developing decorative techniques that catered to the Moghul elites by blending Persian and Indian traditions without offending Islamic sensibilities.  In the case of weapon decoration in Moghul India, the lotus along with other floral motifs finds strong representation.  I will try to upload some examples of the lotus and floral decorative motifs from Moghul India that seem most suggestive of the decorative subject and style of B-Wrecker�s possible priming flask.

Working hypothesis: the possible priming flask was produced by a non-Muslim craftsman/woman in India possibly during the Moghul period.  Because of the artifact�s known association as part of a shipwreck assemblage (we do not know if the vessel was European or Asian), it is also probable that the object found its way to sea as part of the Indian Ocean pilgrimage/trade routes sponsored by the Moghuls, or, conversely, found its way to sea on the Coromandel coast where European vessels were in contact with non-Muslim subjects of the Moghuls.

The first image is a photo of a Tang Dynasty or Five Dynasty (808-929CE) porcelain bowel with a stylized lotus motif.  This piece was manufactured in the Celestial Empire for export along Asia�s maritime silk road and was found as part of the assemblage of the Batu Hitam shipwreck in Indonesia.  This serves as a basic example of the five-petal lotus motif decoration on a utilitarian object made for export.

The second image captures a pair of Moghul battle-axes.  These axes date from the end of the Moghul period, circa 1850 CE.  Note the use of the five-petal lotus motif.  This, of course is an example of the lotus motif used to decorate a weapon.

The third image is a close-up of a Moghul jade dagger hilt.  Again the use of the five-petal lotus motif is present on a weapon.  There is some debate about the exact date of the object; the blade is unquestionably older than the hilt, which appears to be a later addition.  The date of the jade hilt is circa 1750 to 1850.

The fourth image is a black powder weapon, an 18th century Indian Bandukh Torador matchlock.  Note the use of the five-petal lotus motif (as well as other floral design elements) on this weapon.  With respect to B-Wrecker�s possible priming flask, it was suggested that this flask was associated with a pistol.  Matchlock pistols were very popular weapons among these cultural groups: Europeans, Indians, and the Japanese (ranked by popularity of the use of this weapon)

Anyway, this is what I have come up with so far based on the intentionally sparse information provided to prevent bias from creeping into the analysis.  Working only on the photograph, this is the direction the research led me.  I do apologize in the event this hypothesis widely misses its mark.

If any member has better access to Moghul collections and photographs, or any other thought about this artifact of B-Wrecker's please do not hesitate to amplify, correct, or propose ideas.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Bart]

   Probably used with a flintlock or wheellock hunting arm. At the time, hunting was a prerogative for the nobility only, and this priming flask would have served that elite class. Its enameled decoration is very specifically Russian both in motifs and application.

Dimensions for the above item were not given, but it appears to be only a few inches tall. Unless your item has the spout broken off, we may be barking up the wrong tree. What do you think Bahama?

Bart

[bahamawrecker]

Lubby and Bart,

many thanks for the replies.
I will try to post better pictures of the container as well as other artifacts from the same site, in the coming days.
The lid on top, is slightly open on this photo. It is hinged and has indentations in front. The opening, when the lid is open, is nearly square and much too wide to serve as a powder dispenser.
Lubby's identification of the Lotus motive and origin in the Indian Ocean coincides with my own guess. The examples shown by Lubby do indeed have great similarity  in style.
I was looking for a shipwreck that sank towards the end of the 17th century, (exact date known to me) in the Caribbean, when these artifacts were found. If this is indeed the shipwreck we were looking for, its find will be of great historic importance, due to the unique information it will provide on aspects of trade, piracy, slavery and politics of the time. 
So, please continue with the research, we, HH, might be getting very close to a great discovery. 
Bahamawrecker
 

[Bart]

Thank you Bahama, every bit of information helps. If the item is not damaged, then priming flask is out. My first thought on it was that it was an inkwell.

Bart

The 1700's ink well that is attached to the side measures just over an inch square and has a Bombay form being more bulbous in the middle than the bottom and top. The lid is shaped like a shell and is hinged with copper. The inkwell pictured here is attached to a quill holder.


source

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bart and Bahama,

Indeed, the cap mechanism poses a serious problem for the possible identification of Bahama�s artifact as a priming flask: as I wrote above, I have so far not been able to match the exact form of the container or the motif with any certainty.  As long as I am not bothering the wrong tree too much, I hope my barking will be tolerated.  At least we will know a great deal more about priming flasks.  In light of the two recent posts by you both, I was considering abandoning this post to the bone yard; however, there may be some use in returning to the priming flask discussion, so I hope you will indulge me.  While the artifact is now likely not to be a priming flask, and the wonderful suggestion that it may be an inkwell is in play, perhaps we can concentrate on the indentations on the outer edge of the rim.  Is it likely that part of a tension mechanism to hold the lid of the artifact shut is missing?  Additionally, I do not want to lose sight of an observation about which we all appear to be in accord, if I may quote Bart:

The squares below the rim, on either side tend to indicate the object was hung or held upright from them.

In what manner would these square fasteners serve an inkwell?  Perhaps an inkwell for use at sea was secured in some way to a writing table or suspended in some way to swing stable with the movement of the sea - preventing spillage?

 Returning to Bart�s Russian priming flask example. The observation about the object�s association with the elite class are insightful.  The photo is very helpful in highlighting the chief problem of how the top mechanism (?) of Bahama�s object functioned. There appear to be very distinctive trends, fashions, and technical approaches with respect to the design and crafting of priming flasks.

In many cases, particularly the Austro-Hungarian priming flasks, there appears to be a borrowing and influence from Ottoman Turkey.  Moving away from the European cultural sphere, the rounded curves and cap mechanisms become more angular in the first instance and not always spring tensioned in the second.

The first photo is one you have probably already come across, a Turkish priming flask.  Observe angular lines and the interesting approach to the spout cap mechanism.  The second example shows two photos, on the left, a Saxon boxwood, leather and brass priming flask.   On the right is an Austro-Hungarian priming flask that to my mind shows hints of Ottoman tastes and influence.  The third example is a page from one of the few scholarly articles I came across on this topic.  It shows a truly remarkable Italianate priming flask containing fabulous cameos from classical mythology alluding to themes of the hunt.  Very ornate and distinctive objects to say the least.  If anyone has access to the color versions of these photos, do not hesitate to share.

I agree with you completely that I may be off the mark with respect to the utilitarian function of Bahama�s interesting artifact.  I do hope that the taking the risk of being incorrect will allow the discussion and search for identity of the artifact to move forward along a foundation of observations that survive criticism.  I will see what turns up with inkwells.

Works cited for these comments:

A Gift of Powder Flasks
Stephen V. Grancsay
The Metropolitan Museum of Art Bulletin, Vol. 24, No. 5. (May, 1929), pp. 132-134.
 
Renaissance Shell Cameos from the Carrand Collection of the Museo Nazionale del Bargello
Martha A. McCrory
The Burlington Magazine, Vol. 130, No. 1023. (Jun., 1988), pp. 412-426.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Bart and Bahama,

Moving along with Bart�s inkwell hypothesis, and the premise that form follows function, let us pursue the notion that the brass artifact perhaps held a powder or ink, but unlikely a powder associated with firearms.  Let us also hold onto the indication that the brass container was designed to hang upright attached to perhaps leather, cord, or chain material.  Let us also not discard an Indian Ocean provenance.

One initial approach to the object that I did not pursue fully was that the artifact was associated with female travel cosmetics.  Because of the low incidence of artifacts related to the fairer sex occurring in shipwreck sites, I ran with the idea that Bahama�s artifact was firearm related.  I did not want the floral motif to induce a gender bias in the research.  Interestingly, artisans engaged in brassworking made containers of all kinds and types for both male and female utilitarian uses.  Thus many of the techniques found in the fashioning of a priming flask may also be present in other brass objects used to store powders or inks.

How about we put forward the hypothesis that Bahama�s object is related to a portable cosmetic container used by a female?  In this specific case, the brass object could be a kohl pot.  In the middle east, a female�s cosmetic kit would consist of kohl for the eyelids, red pigment for the lips, and henna to adorn other skin surfaces.

Many European privateer and pirate vessels preyed upon Muslim shipping along the great pilgrimage sea route to Mecca.  Female passengers making the Haj to Mecca were fairly common on such Muslim vessels.  It is possible that a portable Kohl kit could have fallen into the hands of a European vessel that had contact with female passengers along this Indian Ocean route (seizure, pillage, etc.).  Of course the importance of an artifact of this type found on a Caribbean wreck can not be overemphasized, but I will not speculate further on that subject.

Returning to the kohl pot idea: here are a few examples that I was able to find.  The first image is a Somali kohl pot with applicator fashioned in brass in a saddlebag design. The second image is the more familiar (and common) ball and tube kohl pot design.  Also of interest would be the presence of other artifacts associated with Muslim females making the Haj.  Accordingly I have posted an example of a female�s porte Koran necklace. Perhaps something of this sort may also turn up.

Of course there are problems with the kohl pot hypothesis.  Again, no clear match for the artifact, its fasteners, and lid immediately surface.  However, collections of feminine utilitarian artifacts are not widely represented and further research will be needed.  I have also not found an exact match with Bahama's object and an inkwell - although I will continue to look.

Best Regards,

Lubby

Works sited for these comments:

The Artistic Heritage of Somalia
Mary Jo Arnoldi
African Arts, Vol. 17, No. 4. (Aug., 1984), pp. 24-33+93.

[Bart]

"Let us also hold onto the indication that the brass container was designed to hang upright attached to perhaps leather, cord, or chain material.  Let us also not discard an Indian Ocean provenance.

One initial approach to the object that I did not pursue fully was that the artifact was associated with female travel cosmetics."

1. We need to see a pic of the bottom of Bahama's item in order to proceed properly. If the bottom is flat, it can safely be stated that it was designed to be stationary on a flat surface. If not, then the square shoulders significance increases mightily. If the bottom is rounded, that would very much indicate that the 2 square shoulders were designed to support the object in some way yet to be determined.


2. We would also need to see a pic of the item with the lid open, if possible, with the inside exposed. These pics will help eliminate much speculation and bring about a quicker identification.

I think a hanging object and womens cosmetic container are mutually exclusive. As the woman was merely a passenger for a brief period on a very rare occasion, there seems no need to design a cosmetic container for that single specific incident in a woman's life.

It also seems that the item is too small to be the ships or captains inkwell, its size very much indicates there would need to be another, larger container of ink to supply it. A bit too redundant and unnecessary for ship life to my thinking. But keep in mind I am a land lubber with a very limited sea knowledge.

All priming flasks that I have seen so far have had rings or loops of some sort for attaching a cord to, it seems significant that this item does not. There doesn't appear to be any indication that there ever were rings or loops on it at all.

From what we know so far, there is only this one such item from the wreck site. That indicates to me that the item was most likely of a personal, and not commercial, nature. It likely isn't cargo. My searches so far have been of 16th century brass inkwell, perhaps expanding it to 16th century brass container would have better results.

Bart

[bahamawrecker]

Bart and Lubby,

many thanks for your great effort in identifying my container. I will, as soon as possible post other artifacts from the same wreck site. These artifacts will probably help a lot in confirming the origin of the shipwreck.
Since we all agree, that the container is most likely coming from the Indian Ocean, I will add one more piece of information now.
There is a contemporary mention that the ship was coming from the Indian Ocean and that it was a pirate.
My problem is that there are many shipwrecks in the area.
It is however very rare to find artifacts from the Indian Ocean in the Caribbean.
My interpretation therefore is that there is a high probability that this is indeed the pirate ship that came from the Indian Ocean.
The few artifacts that we recovered were deeply buried in the mud. We only dug by hand. No tools except metal detectors were used. This lets us hope that a serious archaeological excavation might indeed uncover a real time capsule of immense historical and archaeological value.

While waiting for more pictures, including an other container of very different shape, but similar volume, maybe we should concentrate on the origin of the container more than its function.

I do not want to bias the research, this is why I provide only minimal information at this time.
It does seem to me that the few artifacts that we have are not from a single location in the Indian Ocean but their style is of a variety that seems to indicate a wide spread region or time.
Bahamawrecker

 

[bahamawrecker]

Well, here are some more pictures.
Bahamawrecker

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bahama, Bart, and other HH members,

Thank you for posting these new and intriguing photos of your artifacts.  The container is a wonderful combination of sophisticated, yet simple, design and functionality. Impressive.  Look forward to where the bangle takes the discussion and will of course give my two cents worth.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[bahamawrecker]

Here are some better pictures of the container.
Unfortunately I am on one continent, the artifacts are on another continent and my home is on a third continent. thanks to the Internet I manage to post some pictures in spite of that, but not always it turns out quite right.
Bahamawrecker

[Administration]

Its features bring to mind a matchbox. In particular, the cross-hatching is similar to that used for striking a match, and the shape of the interior for holding matches. The artefact looks designed to fit to a strap, or belt.

The overall look appears to me to be Indian.

[bahamawrecker]

I tend to go along with Administration with a matchbox holder, made in India. Now we must find out when matches were invented and came into use.
Bahamawrecker

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Administrator, Bahama, Bart, & HH Members,

Here are the results of some of the research done on the brass bangle.  The bangle in its form and motif does not appear to have a provenance from the circum-Caribbean.  The first photo posted here is of the skeletal remains of an adult male slave who died on the island of Barbados in the late 17th century or early 18th century. The second photo is a close-up of the bangle found in the burial. The bracelets or bangles found in this slave burial and others like it in the Caribbean region, are almost entirely hand-worked, rounded, and without an applied design motif.  Bahama�s brass bangle is also very dissimilar to French and British trade bracelets found in the Atlantic trade routes.

The earliest closest physical and motif match I have so far found comes from a monograph written by of the famous English Orientalist and Arabic language scholar Edward William Lane (1801-1876) titled An Account of the Manners and Customs of the Modern Egyptians. Volume 2. Within this work there is a short chapter on female adornments from which the following quote comes. With regard to bracelets, Lane is writing about the high-end versions fashioned from gold; however, the dictates of design and material appear transferable to lower-end items made from brass:

Bracelets (asa'wir) are of diamonds or other precious
stones set in gold, or of pearls, or of gold alone. The
more common kinds are represented in an engraving
here inserted.�No. 1 is a side-view of a diamond bracelet
with a front view of a portion of the same.�No. 2
is the most fashionable kind of gold bracelet, which is
formed of a simple twist.�No. 3 is a very common, but
less fashionable kind of bracelet of twisted gold.�No. 4
is also of gold.�These bracelets of gold are pulled
open a little to be put on the wrist. They are generally
made of fine Venetian gold, which is very flexible. (pp. 362-363)

The third photo uploaded shows Lane�s schematic draft of several bracelet or open-ended bangle types.  Number 4 is the design that may be of interest to Bahama.  Lane�s bracelets were produced from gold by hand.  It is likely that a wooden or metal pattern die was used and the artisan pushed the malleable gold into the die form to produce the pattern Lane recorded in figure number 4.  Evidence of this kind of handcraft technique can be seen in Lane�s illustration because the design pattern on the bracelet is visible on both the inner and outer surface of the artifact. It is possible to work brass in this fashion, however, it requires the use of a hammer and die because the metal is correspondingly more rigid than gold.  Bahama�s bangle evidences a design pattern on only the outer surface.  The inner surface is smooth.  Some brass bracelets are formed of two pieces, the outer stamped or hand-worked piece and a smooth inner piece that is soldered onto the outer bangle�s inner surface.  If this is the case, it may be possible to see a slight solder line or bead present on the artifact. Unlike the Caribbean example from Barbados, the ends of Bahama�s bangle retain a square edge as in Lane�s example and this might suggest a middle eastern provenance that does not exclude India.  The most datable element of Bahama�s bangle would be the terminal decorations at each open end of the bangle which can not be seen in the provided photo. 

It is very hard to date this object.  Soldering techniques are almost as ancient as metallurgy itself. However the beadwork and patterns on Bahama�s bangle are very tightly grouped and precise. These linear design elements on brass pieces are not well documented and further research is needed to narrow the geographic range.  Any information on the terminal decorations, if present, would be of use.  So far gold work patterns for Alexandria, Egypt from the 19th century are the closest match, but there are still dozens of sources to consult and nothing written in this post is to be construed as an attempt to date the object or exclude a particular date.

Very interested in the match box idea.  There is a great deal of material on match boxes, the history of the match, a very serious research rabbit-hole to go down.

Best Regards to All,

Lubby

Works cited for these comments:

The Atlantic Slave Trade and Slave Life in the America�s: A Visual Record by Jerome S. Handler and Michael L. Tuite Jr.

Edward William Lane
An Account of the Manners and Customs of the Modern Egyptians. Volume 2 (1833-1835)

Herbert Maryon
85. Archaeology and Metallurgy. I. Welding and Soldering
Man, Vol. 41. (Nov. - Dec., 1941), pp. 118-124.

[Bart]

If your item is a matchbox, it will not be a 16th or 17th century artifact. Possibly mid to late 19th century, if it is of India origin, as it appears to be. How does this fit into the context of the other wreck artifacts Bahama?

Bart
************

In 1669, phosphorous was discovered - phosphorous was soon used in match heads.

In 1680, an Irish physicist named Robert Boyle (Boyle's Law) coated a small piece of paper with phosphorous and coated a small piece of wood with sulfur. He then rubbed the wood across the paper and created a fire. However, there was no useable match created by Robert Boyle.

In 1827, John Walker, English chemist and apothecary, discovered that if he coated the end of a stick with certain chemicals and let them dry, he could start a fire by striking the stick anywhere. These were the first friction matches. The chemicals he used were antimony sulfide, potassium chlorate, gum, and starch. Walker did not patent his "Congreves" as he called the matches (alluding to the Congreve's rocket invented in 1808). Walker was a former chemist at 59 High Street, in Stockton-on-Tees, England. His first sale of the matches was on April 7, 1827, to a Mr. Hixon, a solicitor in the town. Walker made little money from his invention. He died in 1859 at the age of 78 and is buried in the Norton Parish Churchyard in Stockton. (br1781- d1859)

One Samuel Jones saw Walker's "Congreves" and decided to market them, calling his matches "Lucifers". "Lucifers" became popular especially among smokers, but they had a bad burning odor.

In 1830, the French chemist, Charles Sauria, created a match made with white phosphorous. Sauria's matches had no odor, but they made people sick with a ailment dubbed "phossy jaw". White phosphorous is poisonous.

In 1855, safety matches were patented by Johan Edvard Lundstrom of Sweden. Lundstrom put red phosphorus on the sandpaper outside the box and the other ingredients on the match head, solving the problem of "phossy jaw" and creating a match that could only be safely lit off the prepared, special striking, surface.

In 1889, Joshua Pusey invented the matchbook, he called his matchbook matches "Flexibles". Pusey's patent was unsuccessfully challenged by the Diamond Match Company who had invented a similar matchbook (their striker was on the outside, Pusey's was on the inside). His patent was later purchased by the Diamond Match Company in 1896 for $4,000 and a job offer.

In 1910, the Diamond Match Company patented the first nonpoisonous match in the U.S., which used a safe chemical called sesquisulfide of phophorous.

United States President William H. Taft publicly asked Diamond Match to release their patent for the good of mankind. They did on January 28, 1911, Congress placed a high tax on matches made with white phosphorous.

http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blmatch.htm

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bart and Bahama (as well as Administration),

Excellent summary of the history of matches Bart.  It would appear that the emergence of the modern match circa 1827 coincided with the disappearance of the personal tinder box (circa 1837).  Perhaps I may advance the idea that the brass container functioned as a tinder box - this would allow only a slight modification of Administration's observation that the container is a match box.  A tinder box would accommodate my only slight reservation about the match box identification - the brass container is neither cylindrical nor perfectly square.  Additonally, Bahama's artifact echos a leather tinder pouch in some respects.

Here is a quote from Mr. Miller Christy, an early 20th century English collector of tinder boxes:

Throughout Turkestan, northern India, Tibet, Mongolia, and central Asia generally, a special form of leather tinder-pouch, intended to be carried on the waist belt, is in general use.  Probably in the high, dry plateau of central Asia, a mere leather pouch suffices to keep the tinder dry; whereas in our moister insular climate some form of box is necessary (p. 200).

There are several possibilities for further research into the precise provenance of Bahama's tinder (match) box.  Are there any other clues that were found close to this assemblage, flints perhaps?

In any event, it may be possible to narrow down whether the object is a match or a tinder box.  If the determination is that it is a tinder box, than the artifact may predate the 19th century.

Works cited for these comments:

Miller Christy
Concerning Tinder-Boxes. Article III. - Personal Tinder-Boxes
The Burlington Magazine for Connoisseurs, Vol. 3, No. 8. (Nov., 1903),

Best Regards to All,

Lubby

P.S. I have images of 19th century leather tinder pouches and their fasteners if this is of interest.

[Bart]

Hi Lubby, tinderbox may be a possibility, but the old saw comes to the fore here, size matters. To me it seems to be quite small for the purpose. I do like the idea that it held something light though. Were the container filled with sand for example, the loops appear to be well below the midpoint of gravity, and the container appears to me that it would tip upside down easily. Perhaps the strap went down through one loop, then beneath the container and back up through the other loop, it may be much more stable. Assuming of course a leather strap was used, and it was meant to carried around the neck or hung on a belt. Assumptions can lead astray often enough.

It also seems to be gender specific, I think it is a guy thing. Imagine having to carry this thing around, what would you keep in it? Custom and culture would come into play here. For some reason, I can't picture a woman having to tote this thing everywhere.

Bart

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bart,

Very good points and comments as usual.  I agree entirely with you on the center of gravity of the object with respect to the bottom loops; however, looking at Bahama's latest set of photos, I imagined a rather elegant arrangement for the strap: the leather strap, after passing under the lower loops, then passes through the narrow brass slits on the upper sides of the artifact on each side just below the lid.  I could be interpreting the photo incorrectly though, so do not hesitate to say so.

I would be hesitant to gender-type the artifact at this point, although I have posted that the possibility should be entertained that the artifact might be associated with a female accoutrement.  Since we are moving in the match-box or tinder-box direction your point that the artifact should be associated with a male certainly pull me into your orbit.  As with the in-situ photo I posted, bracelets were also worn by males in many cultures.  Personal tinder boxes also.  In fact, Asian fashion for such objects tends to take almost purse-like forms.

I will plow through some more collections latter in the day and see what else turns up.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bahama and Bart,

Here is another post on the on-going research into the form and style of the brass container that Bahama was gracious enough to share with HH.  We at HH are entertaining the idea that the artifact is perhaps a brass match/tinder box.  Because there is a belief that the decorative motif on the object is Asian and perhaps Indian, an effort has been made to find additional similarities in the form of the object that might give some insight into its provenance.  The research progressed along the lines that the brasswork form of the artifact echoed another material, perhaps leather.

In the last post I made, I was unable to locate any Indian or central Asian examples of leather forms close enough to suggest a strong affinity with Bahama�s find.  However, I was able to find a strong tradition of belt or strap fastened tinder and tobacco pouches.  One of the problems in linking Bahama's artifact with the central Asian leather forms, which did strongly influence metalwork as the Mongols expanded into China and the near east, is that the cover flap of the leather pouch was very often carried over into metal designs.  Additionally, I could find no example in central Asian or Indian collections of the very elegant ring and strap arrangement evident on Bahamas piece.

Then Bart posted his comments directing my attention to the center of gravity issue with the artifact.  These comments drew attention, again to the very unique upper slits through which, presumably, the straps of the brass object passed.  This design feature might serve as a basis to classify some characteristic of the object. 

A new approach: what if the brass artifact drew its inspiration from a wooden form?  Are there any stylistic affinities between Bahama�s object and Asian cultures that produced tinder-pouches or boxes from wood?

As the research unfolded, something of interest did turn up that might be of interest.  The series of photos uploaded with this post are of a tobacco box made on the island of Taiwan (historically Formosa) by one of the nine aboriginal cultures that are known to have inhabited the island, the Paiwan.  This Paiwan tobacco box is much larger than Bahama�s brass piece (w 3�, d 1.5�, h 9.75�) and is dated circa 1800 CE.  It is fashioned from an undetermined hardwood.  Of particular note, and immediately striking, is the design and form of the wooden loops through which the rope-strap fastens to the body of the box.  Moreover, the lid of this wooden form articulates along the rope in a very elegant design that echoes the presumed strap configuration of Bahama�s artifact.

I should also point out the design motif of the Paiwanese Tobacco box is very likely floriate inspired.

The Paiwan share numerous cultural and linguistic similarities with groups along the Philippine-Indonesian arc of islands (Paiwanese is a member of the Western Austronesian language family � or Malagasy-Polynesian in most sources).  This European contact with the Paiwanese, as well as with the other indigenous groups on the island of Taiwan, began with the Spanish and Portuguese but between 1624 and 1662, the Dutch established a strong presence on the island and exerted a powerful influence from forts established at Zeelandia and Proventia.  Of course Dutch Formosa during this period became a major entrepot for trade between China, Japan, the Dutch East Indies and thence to Europe. 

Now I am not suggesting that Bahama�s brass container is a direct copy of a Paiwanese form, however, there would appear to grounds to link the form of Bahama�s brass container to a wooden antecedent, perhaps a tobacco or tinder box, inspired by one of the island cultures of the Pacific-Indian Ocean archipelagos, perhaps as far west as Madagascar, for whom the crafting of utilitarian objects from hardwood was the norm.  While there may be some distant link to the form of Bahama's artifact with Malagasy forms, it is nevertheless equally clear from the brasswork and the decorative motif that Indian or Hindu aesthetics also exerted a heavy influence.

Works cited for these comments:

A Note on Japanese Research in Formosa
Herbert Passin
American Anthropologist, New Series, Vol. 49, No. 3. (Jul. - Sep., 1947), pp. 514-518

Dutch-Aboriginal Interaction in New Netherland and Formosa: An Historical Geography of Empire
Laurence M. Hauptman; Ronald G. Knapp
Proceedings of the American Philosophical Society, Vol. 121, No. 2. (Apr. 29, 1977), pp. 166-182.

[bahamawrecker]

Bart and Lubby,

many thanks for your great research. I have not had time to read and reply, so I send two more pictures of another container from the same wreck site in the mean time.
It is somehow of the same family, being crudely manufactured, maybe copied from a much more elaborate original, by an artist of lesser capacity.
Bahamawrecker   

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Thank you Bahama for the latest photo of a second brass container from your shipwreck assemblage.  During the course of looking into the second artifact, I decided to take another stab at narrowing down the floral motif (motive) of your first.  In an earlier post I suggested that the design was affiliated with the five-petal lotus pattern � a pattern associated with Asian decorative arts for many centuries.

However, Administration and Bart have directed our attention to the possibility of your objects being associated with matches specifically and perhaps personal fire-starting in general.  Of course such utilitarian objects in the early modern and modern periods evolved hand in hand with the smoking of both opium and tobacco.  It is often forgotten that both opium and tobacco produce very attractive blossoms.  Is there then any possible link between the floral motif on Bamhama�s first object (B1) and these two narcotic flowering plants?  The opium poppy motif search did not result in an identifiable five-petal motif; however, the tobacco flower, to my great surprise, did.  I have uploaded a modern photograph of nicotiana tabacum along with two renditions, the first of which occurs on an Aztec statue of Xochipilli, the prince of flowers.  Note the tobacco blossom on the right thigh of the god.  The second illustrated image derives from the work of Leonhart Fuchs and is described by author Anna Pavod as representing a:

[d]etail showing the flowers of the tobacco-plant, from a manuscript compiled under the direction of Leonhart Fuchs (1501-66), professor of medicine at the university of T�bingen. Fuchs was one of the first men to study plants for their own sake, as well as for their medical applications. His De historia stirpium commentarii insignes of 1542 was the second notable printed herbal produced in Germany, supplanting Otto Brunfels� Herbarum vivae icones (1530-36), even though the illustrations in the older work were of a higher quality. Fuchs laboured for the last twenty-four years of his life in the compilation of a much larger botanical encyclop�dia, commissioning and collecting hundreds of high-quality illustrations, which included some of the earliest known depictions of such novelties as the tomato and tobacco plants: but this opus never made it to the press. (Pavod, The Naming of Names, figure 4)

The discussion of B1 and B2 becomes more intriguing should the floral representation on B1 prove to be that of a tobacco flower.  In the first instance, the craftsmanship and technique of the artifacts yet appear Indian or south Asian.  The tobacco motif appearing on an artifact where the botanical plant itself was not native and introduced by Europeans will offer a better chance of narrowing down areas in Asia where such a tobacco motif could have developed on a native art-form.  I believe tobacco cultivation was introduced into Asia by the Portuguese and Spanish at the end of the 16th century.  It might be fruitful to review the history of the spread of tobacco cultivation in Asia to see if any regions emerge that produced objects associated with the tobacco habit and tobacco trade using local lost-wax casting methods and materials.   

Works consulted for these comments:

Anna Pavod
The Naming of Names. Bloomsbury USA, 2005

Here is the link to the University of Edinburgh Special Collections Division where Fuchs� De historia stirpium commentarii insignes  resides in fond:

http://www.lib.ed.ac.uk/resources/collections/specdivision/botmaug06.shtml

Best Regards,

Lubby

[bahamawrecker]

Hi everybody and thanks for the feedback.
I am underway and have just a minute, so here is the last picture of the series.
More do come soon. (after I have time to read all your interesting posts)
Bahamawrecker

[Jesus of Lubeck]

I would like to make a few comments in general about the B1 and B2 artifacts.  When studying the early-modern world, I am often startled at how interconnected it actually was. To state it simply � it was an age, like our own, characterized by a dramatic exchange across vast spans of geography of both trade objects and people.  With respect to B1 and B2, the possibility should be investigated whether an Indian or south Asian community was transferred to the Caribbean and perhaps used their native knowledge and technique to craft these objects.  Whoever made B1 was familiar enough with nicotiana tabacum to render a very fluid and naturalistic design incorporating the flower into a motif.  Are there any areas of tobacco cultivation in the circum-Caribbean area where south Asian communities or groups also were present?  Such a possibility should be investigated along with other major theories on the provenance of the artifacts, along with running down other leads.

The second comment I would like to politely make regards the five-petal lotus blossom motif often described by historians of Asian art.  If an Asian object was known to have been produced after the late 16th century in Asia, particularly an area where tobacco cultivation was introduced, the five-petal motif may not represent the ubiquitous lotus.

With respect to the latest artifacts - again, well done Bahama, and thank you for sharing these remarkable finds with HH.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Jesus of Lubeck]

The Bahama spur artifact is fortunately endowed with an avian decoration in an awkwardly prominent position.  This bird looks suspiciously like a waterfowl and could be a Burmese hintha.  The hintha (in Pali: Hamsa, or in English: goose) is noteworthy in so far as it was the royal symbol of the lower Myanmar Kingdom of Hanthawaddy (commonly referred to in English historical writings as the Kingdom of Pegu), which reached the zenith of its power between 1364 and 1555.  After this period, the history of the Mon in Myanmar becomes less clear.  A Burman dynasty, the Toungoo, destroyed the political unity of the independent Mon kingdom.  It appears that several Mon city-states retained their independence into the 17th century.  At the beginning of the 17th century, the Portuguese made a serious attempt to conquer Myanmar but were repulsed in 1613 CE.  In any event, the hintha, besides being a royal symbol during the period of the Mon Kingdom, continued to be associated as a Mon symbol.

I came across the hintha during the quest for utilitarian brass objects cast using the lost-wax method in Austronesian culture areas.  Bahama�s spur (B4 � should we start numbering them?) artifact possesses what could be a hintha decoration and indicate a Mon or southern Myanmar provenance (not ruling out the Nicobar Islands which are also ethnically and linguistically Mon).  I have uploaded two images of opium weights containing Mon hintha forms from brass lost-wax cast techniques. The first is a wide-ranging group of undetermined date.  The Second is a weight dated to the 17th century.  Should Bahama�s latest posted find prove to be a Mon artifact in a 17th century shipwreck in the Caribbean, it can only belong to a very small and very interesting number of possible vessels.  Very exciting stuff.  Let us see how the dating of the assemblage holds up.

As it stands, perhaps we can focus some research into the Mon techniques of lost-wax casting, which incidentally was very highly developed.  Moreover, did the Europeans introduce tobacco to any of the Mon areas?  If so, when?  I think I hear the sound of one of Tom Zart�s hinges moving a little.

This is all very tentative so please feel free offer comments an criticism.  There is a great deal I have to learn about this subject.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[bahamawrecker]

A time capsule? or an archaeologist's nightmare?

The place where our mystery shipwreck lies.

Could the location of the shipwreck shed some light on the origin of the artifacts?
 
This shipwreck has yet to be excavated. For this reason I will hold back on the name and  some details of the location.
However, to further the research and to make it possible to give this research some direction, I will disclose as much as possible information.
Please feel free to ask for more details.

The location is in the Caribbean.
It is a harbor.
As such it has been hit by dozens of  Hurricanes over the centuries. Every Hurricane claimed some of the ships that were in the harbor at that time.
Then there were the battles, fires, earthquakes and tidal waves. Historic records tell us of some of these events and of the ensuing shipwrecks.
How many shipwrecks?
Off course we know not, about every ship that sank, but we do know that there are several hundred shipwrecks within 10 square miles.
This means that the probabilities are high that the scatter trail of one shipwreck can cross over and be intermingled with the wreckage originating from several other shipwrecks. 
From the point of view of an archaeologist this might be a nightmare.
Why?
With artifacts of many different origins and time frame it becomes very difficult to tell to which shipwreck a specific artifact belongs.

The artifacts shown here come from a very small area. They were buried in deep mud. This could indicate that the artifacts are resting on the bottom of the sea since considerable time.
Other artifacts found close by give a fairly good time frame of the year 1700, give or take 25 years.
This is consistent with the time of the sinking of the two shipwrecks that we were trying to find. 
Bahamawrecker

[bahamawrecker]

Fantastic detective work, Lubby.
You seem to close in to the origin of the artifacts in a uncanny way.
This leaves me with a dilemma about which artifact I should post next.
The reference to wax casting above, might have a connection to the next artifact.

Crude copies?
The artifacts depicted above have a certain artistic charm, in spite of being fashioned in a way that suggests a craftsman using unsophisticated tools and average skill, rather than a highly skilled artist.
Could it be that the artifacts are crude copies of more artful originals?
Or should I reason the opposite way.
Were the containers meant to be simple, low cost implements for every day use, crafted by a craftsman with an inkling of artistry?

Maybe the next piece will give insights. Or... will it raise more questions? 

An artists workshop?

This piece is rough cast.
No further work has been added after it was removed from the casting mold. The casting mold appears to have been made of sand. Possibly the artwork was first formed out of wax, then the wax sculpture was embedded in some kind of cohesive sand. The liquid metal was then poured into the mold.
The wax melted and evaporated from the heat. The metal (copper?, brass?, bronze?) filled the voids.

This method is called the lost wax casting. It has been used since thousands of years. It allows for very detailed work.
When we look at the details of the figures, we notice immediately the coarseness and lack of fine detail.
Was it that the artist wanted to finish the details by carving and filing later?
Was this a casting experiment?
There seems to be a strange mixture of coarseness and detail. Even though the figures are rough and crude,  we can recognize many details in the shapes.
Some of these details are quite baffling. For example, the �breasts� on the figure on the right.
Is this supposed to represent a warrior women?
Is this the reason why this figure's hips are wide, while the hips of the figure on the left are narrow?

Well, I have to admit defeat. These crude little figures have me perplexed.

Could somebody be so kind and solve this enigma?
Bahamawrecker
     

[Administration]

The figures remind of those in coastal West Africa, such as Benin.

1700s Africa-US African slaves initially used to work in tobacco fields, not on cotton plantations

1650s South Africa European settlers grow tobacco and use it as a form of currency

1560 Africa Portuguese and Spaniards ship tobacco to East Africa, where it spread to Central and
West Africa

History of Tobacco

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bahama and Greetings to Administrator,

I was just now able to view your new post (B5) and have to say that Administrator was kind enough to point us in the right direction.  It is very likely you have a West African bronze cast using the lost wax technique.  The following comments are predicated on the assumption that B5 is a small artifact.  Are you able, by the way, to tell us anything about the size and if the underside of the base of the artifact is flat or if a prong is present?

I can tell you something more about B5 and someone with the correct permissions might be able to do a better job getting a larger, higher resolution image, than the one I uploaded here.

The Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco contains a solitary example of what its collection describes as an amulet of Ivorian (Ivory Coast) provenance [item: 1990.40.8] In the SF example, which I have posted, there are two figures cast in bronze in what one might describe primitive or rough workmanship.  It is difficult to tell the size of B5, however, it illustrates strong stylistic affinities to the Ivorian amulet. The Ivorian artifact is very small � approximately 5.4cm across the base.  The Ivorian amulet is 20th  century and is not as well executed as B5.  As is becoming Bahama�s habit, the artifact type is rare and not particularly well-documented. There is more about the figures in B5 to consider, but I am pressed for time, unfortunately and will have to post on that area of the discussion later if there is interest.  Two points perhaps worth considering: the Ivorian amulet does not utilize spear and shield in its design and the presence of this weapon suite in B5 may suggest that the object dates to a period when firearms were not in wide-spread use in West Africa (outside of royal units).  Second, there is a strong tradition of matrilinial power among West African culture groups.  In the artistic representation and cultural traditions of this area, it is not unusual to see powerful female forms represented with items associated with male power, such as weaponry. 

It is important to note that this type of amulet, if B5 is such an object, was a piece of utilitarian spiritual technology endowed with a power to ward off evil or protect against certain specific situations.  The production and casting of this type of object was attended by a rather serious set of spiritual rituals of major importance to the power endowed to the amulet.

For the moment, it is difficult to say more about the vessel that carried these artifacts other than to admit that the crew was multi-ethnic and was drawn by choice or by force from the shores of wide geographical span.

Thank you Administration for the Tobacco link.  Indeed, Bahama, very, very, interesting site you have happened upon.  We all will have to ponder how all of this evidence interrelates.  More later and hope to read from more of HH members.

Again, if someone has better access to image 1990.40.8 or a better example of this type of  artifact, it would be gratifying to study a better photo.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Administration]

Greetings Lubby, Bart and Bahama,

My hypothesis - made merely on casual judgments - is that these artefacts came from a single ship, either Portuguese or with Portuguese cargo, following a sea route from India (possibly Goa), to coastal West Africa (possibly Benin), delivering slaves to the Americas. (There was massive exportation of slaves to Brazil in the 17th century.)

I think we have an Indian brass box associated with tobacco, and bronzework typical of West Africa. To go further than this would, I think, require both archaeological study of the context and expert study of the artefacts.

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Administration, Bahama, and Bart,

I would have to agree with Administration's succinct and well-directed casual judgments.  Much depends on the fragile matrix of the context of the wrecksite and the nuances of the relationship between this context and the artifacts - fascinating as they are in themselves.  To venture beyond Administration's casual hypothesis at our far remove would serve little practical purpose.  A professional expert on the scene would serve you efforts supremely at this point (and perhaps one already is).

Best Regards,

Lubby

[bahamawrecker]

Thanks everybody,
attached one more picture of B5, on it you can see the hand holding it. This gives an idea about its size.
The next picture, an elephant, B6, still from the same site, seems to be of the same origin.

There are a few more artifacts, of which I will post pictures in the coming days.

About the wreck site:

We found this site 17 years ago. For many years we have tried to obtain a permit from the local government to excavate the site and to open a museum where we could tell the story of the ship, its travels and final sinking, and all the other fascinating stories that this shipwreck could tell us. 
We never received a permit, so this site has been sleeping ever since.
Probably Hurricanes and shipping have taken their toll, but for sure there is still a fascinating wreck site well worth excavating.
Unless, of course, if a harbor wall or a Marina has been built on top of it.

So here is my question:

How should we proceed about this wreck site?

Bahamawrecker

[Bart]

How should you proceed?

From the artifacts alone, it appears to me that the site is worth more attemps to have it excavated. The answer of how best to proceed, or not, may well depend upon which country you are referring to.

Some questions which you need to clarify for yourself - Must it be you/your team who proceeds, or are you willing to allow someone else to proceeed and excavate? Often enough, public pressure can be utilized in your favor, and that may necessitate some public education first. One of the most powerful tools in your favor are the artifacts you already posess. Document and publicize what you have done already, and let it be known what you wish to do now.

What were the reasons for not issuing an excavation permit, if any were given? How has the situation changed since 17 years ago? More information would help us in better answering the question more specifically.

Bart

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bahama, Bart, and Administration,

My home desktop system has gone to the Happy Hunting Ground- too much writing?  In any event, I will have limited access to the HH Website for a day or two.  Bahama - really wonderful finds.  Thank you again for sharing.  I have more information on tobacco in 17th century India which I hope to post.  The West African (Bight of Benin) bronzes are also historically interesting.

I agree with Bart and also suggest that you look to see if any University has longstanding and ongoing archaeological field operatons in the country in question.  Usually the University and the project or program archaeologist(s) have the necessary relationships with the local Ministry of Culture to propose undertaking excavation projects that add to the cultural heritage of the country where the site is located.

Again, if I appear to slow down on posting comments, it is only due to a technical problem not lack of interest.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Administration]

I spent quite some time in the Benin area (80s and 90s) specifically to study that culture and built quite a collection of their bronzes. Perhaps I will post on this separately.

Future progress
Bart and Lubby gives good advice. It is possible (even usual) for university archaeologists to work initially in strict confidence - they are keen to protect a site from looting. Some are also used to working with non-archaeologists, especially in excavation.

If there is no local university with the needed requirements, then I can refer you to an institution or two who may be interested in taking this forward with you. Contacting Yellowboat via email could also be useful.

Cheers!

[bahamawrecker]

Thanks, Bart, Lubby and Administration,
It is wonderful to get your help.

We would love to get help for the excavation of this shipwreck. Actually there are 2 shipwrecks that sank together. We have a lot of historic information about the other one, but only just one statement about this one, where it says that it came from the Indian Ocean.
We never got a refusal from the government about the excavation, just no interest and a merry run around for several years, until we gave up. The government was fully informed about the shipwreck in their harbor 17 years ago but has not done anything about it.

The shipwreck being in the harbor, in view of everybody, no work can be done without everybody knowing it.
This means that, once started, all work has to be executed diligently, without interruption, otherwise the site will get plundered.

We would like to be involved in a scientifically organized excavation of the site and retain the publishing rights for ourself.
Similar to the "Mary Rose" project, we would like the sport diving community given a chance to participate in the field work, as well as other volunteers help for cataloging and preservation of the artifacts.
We would like to be able to build a museum where we could let the shipwrecks tell their story.

Please feel free to ask questions.


Additional information

The wreck site:

The site lies within the protected waters of a harbor.
The bottom is clay, sand and mud.
No part of the shipwreck is visible above the mud.
Visibility in the water is a few feet at most, but often only inches or nil.
Maximum depth is 50 feet.

The island where the harbor lies, changed hands several times over the centuries.
The harbor was sometimes a busy commercial hub, where trade of every kind, including slave trade, flourished.
It is also known to be a place where pirates could sell their ill gotten goods without many questions asked.
Among other pirates, Captain Kidd is supposed to have sold some of his plunder there.

As far as we know, no salvage has been done in modern times, but it seems that some cannon were removed after the ship sank.
The only intervention we did ourselves, was to swim over the bottom with metal detectors. When the detector indicated we dug with our hands to reach the artifact. All artifacts that were perishable were buried again.
The few artifacts that we removed to enable us to identify the wreck site, are the ones shown here.

Attached, artifact B-7, still from the same site.

Bahamawrecker

[Bart]

Bahama;

" We never got a refusal from the government about the excavation, just no interest and a merry run around for several years, until we gave up. "

There could be several reasons for this... no money to start or be involved in such a project, no means or capability of performing such a project, no comprehensive plan was given them on how the excavation was to be carried out, or a combination of all of them. A different  approach is now required, it seems to me. Put together a presentation/plan as best as you can and approach a third party, as suggested, until you find someone interested enough to move forward with it.

" We would like to be involved in a scientifically organized excavation of the site and retain the publishing rights for ourself. "

Certainly your experience is just that, your experience, and no one can take that from you. Access to data may need to be written into any agreement you make, if you need to have it for your book. Or you will need to make provision to document everything that you are involved in in order to create your own data.

In the B-7jpg, I see what appears to be a thin leather strap over the left shoulder of the dancer, with a buckle? high up on the arm. Is anything attached to this strap, hanging at the right hip? It is a very detailed object, and appears to be cast.

"Indian brass box associated with tobacco"

This seems to be a bit early for tobacco, but that possibility remains.

Bart

[bahamawrecker]

Bart,
Thank you for the reply.
Attached B-7b the dancer from behind.
Well, many years have passed. We have found other extremely interesting sites in the mean time.
However, this site does have a special attraction and I really would love to have another go at it. But age has slowed me down quite a bit. I could only face the huge enterprise if I find 
enough help.
This is what made me think of a group of volunteers who make it their joint effort.
Probably the right kind of proposal would be welcome to the government today, although I am not sure if this site, being situated in dirty, poor visibility water will be received with great excitement.
Time will tell...

[Bart]

I think if you find a young, enthusiastic group with the right mind-set, it may happen yet. Would it be possible for an ROV to do some of the work there, in your opinion?

I was hoping the dancer would have a small brass container attached to the leather strap. :-)

Bart

[Bart]

Scientists Take Underwater Robot On Black Sea Expedition

Science Daily � Using a novel underwater robot, University of Delaware marine scientists will help reveal the mysteries of the Black Sea's geology and maritime history, including ages-old shipwrecks, during an international expedition that is now underway.

Using a novel underwater robot, UD marine scientists will help reveal the mysteries of the Black Sea's geology and maritime history, including ages-old shipwrecks, during an international expedition that is now underway. (Credit: Jon Cox)

The Institute for Exploration and the Institute for Archaeological Oceanography at the University of Rhode Island's Graduate School of Oceanography are leading the mission, which will conduct geological and archaeological research in the Aegean and Black Seas--waterways that have served as major trade routes for centuries.

Robert Ballard, professor of oceanography at the University of Rhode Island, and president of the Institute for Exploration, is the principal investigator on the research cruise, which will include a multidisciplinary team of scientists from several nations.

�This is a truly exciting expedition that will shed light on important geological features in the Mediterranean while also uncovering vital information about ancient trade routes and the maritime history of the Black Sea,� Ballard said.

Perhaps best known for locating the sunken ocean liner Titanic in 1985, Ballard has received numerous honors for scientific research and public education. He was awarded an honorary doctor of science degree by UD in 2001.

Last year, in partnership with the Department of Underwater Heritage in Ukraine, Ballard's research team located numerous shipwrecks in the Black Sea, including a vessel from the Byzantine period that will be revisited and explored during this expedition.

The research vessel NRV Alliance will serve as the scientists' home, lab and the platform from which remotely operated vehicles with high-definition cameras will be deployed to provide high-resolution images of the deep.

From the Ukrainian research vessel Flamingo, Art Trembanis, UD assistant professor of marine and Earth studies, and graduate students Adam Skarke and Stephanie Nebel, together with colleagues from the Center for Coastal and Ocean Mapping at the University of New Hampshire and Ballard's own team, will operate the autonomous underwater vehicle (AUV) DOERRI (pronounced �Dory�), which stands for �Delaware Oceanographic and Environmental Research Remote Instrument.�

�My students and I are tremendously honored to be participating in this unprecedented project,� Trembanis said. �We are working with a real pioneer in the field of ocean exploration--a hero and mentor to an entire generation of marine scientists, myself included,� he noted.

The 83-inch-long, 240-pound DOERRI, which Trembanis designed, will map the seafloor of the Black Sea off Sevastopol, Ukraine, on missions up to 14 hours long and to depths of approximately 200 meters (656 feet).

�As a child, I remember waking up early on Saturday mornings not to watch cartoons, but to catch the latest National Geographic Explorer episode that Dr. Ballard might be hosting, and now I find myself fulfilling a childhood dream to work alongside Dr. Ballard and his expert team of researchers. It is truly exciting,� Trembanis said.

The DOERRI carries a sophisticated sensor system including devices to measure salinity, temperature and oxygen levels and two types of advanced sonar systems for mapping the seafloor. Multiple computers and safety features work in tandem to keep the systems operating, and to safely return the vehicle back to the ship at the end of each day.

In many ways, DOERRI may serve as the scientists' �agent into the unknown� much like the AUV's namesake, the cartoon fish �Dory,� did in the Disney film Finding Nemo.

�Just like her eponymous namesake, we hope that DOERRI will be a finder of lost things,� Trembanis said. �We hope DOERRI will provide unrivaled data that will allow us to discover very ancient shipwrecks, previously unknown, on the Black Sea floor,� he noted. �Along the way, DOERRI will also give us new insights into the dynamics of dissolved oxygen and internal waves that help to shape and mold the seafloor.�

Shipwrecks in the Black Sea often are remarkably well-preserved due to the waterway's chemistry. Nearly 90 percent of the Black Sea is a no-oxygen �dead zone,� where only a few bacteria live.

�At depths beyond 150 meters, the Black Sea is not unlike a giant natural bell jar from which life-supporting oxygen has been entirely removed,� Trembanis said.

A major advantage of AUVs like DOERRI, Trembanis said, is that they allow researchers to literally become more immersed in the marine environment.

�By severing the cord to the surface, we become more a part of the environment we are studying because we can approach things just as a curious fish might do,� Trembanis said. �In real terms, the AUV provides capabilities to get below the influence of surface conditions and get closer to the features on the seafloor we wish to study without actually touching or disturbing anything around us. Furthermore, we can ask the robot to do critical but perhaps monotonous tasks over and over again--tasks that give us great scientific data, but tasks that would seem boring to human operators.�

Locally, DOERRI has been used in a variety of research in Delaware's coastal waters, including nearshore areas of Delaware Bay and the Atlantic Ocean and in Delaware's Inland Bays.

While this will be the DOERRI's farthest trip from home so far, it likely will not be its last. Trembanis said the leading-edge robot already is scheduled for another international mission, to explore the coral reefs off Bonaire, early next year.

The expedition is supported by NOAA's Office of Ocean Exploration, the Office of Naval Research and the Richard Lounsbery Foundation. Participating institutions include the French Research Institute for Exploitation of the Sea, University of Texas, Institute for Classical Archaeology, Naval Meteorological and Oceanography Command, University of Delaware, University of Massachusetts at Boston, University of New Hampshire and Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution.

Note: This story has been adapted from a news release issued by University of Delaware.


http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/08/070815173122.htm

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Administration, Bart, and Bahama,

Here are some brief comments on the spread of the cultivation and trade in tobacco in 17th century India.

As Administration noted with respect to Africa in a previous post, the Spanish and Portuguese are likely to have introduced the cultivation and smoking of nicotinia tabacum to Asia.  Primary sources indicate that tobacco first came to the Indian subcontinent in Iberian vessels in the last years of the 16th century.

Scholars note that tobacco is nowhere mentioned in the Ain-i-Akbari, the administrative compendium of the court chronicler for the Moghal ruler Akbar (1556-1605).  This suggests that tobacco was not a major portion of the Moghal tax base during this reign.  Akbar, however, was aware of and introduced to tobacco, although he appears to never have taken smoking up as a habit.

It was during the reign of Akbar�s successor, Jahangir (1605-1627) that tobacco cultivation and use becomes widely documented in the historical record.  Because it is likely that Bahama�s artifacts relate to the late 17th century, further comments will concentrate on Indian tobacco during this period.

As a primary source for the tobacco trade in India in the 17th century, the Factory Records of the English East India Company are the most accessible due to the convenience of having been written in English (if one is familiar with the paleography).  From these records scholars have identified two major centers of Indian tobacco cultivation.  In western India Gujarat, utilizing Surat as a major market and port city, was the leading producing center during the 17th century.  This western Indian tobacco market also exported the product to Gombroon and other ports on the Indian Ocean-Red Sea-Persian Gulf littoral.

Along India�s eastern coast, Andhra developed as the major 17th century tobacco-growing region.  The chief port in this area was Masulipatam in the kingdom of Golkanda.  This is a general snapshot of the 17th century Indian tobacco economy, so it should be understood that a significant amount of tobacco was grown in a wide range of areas across India.  English factors report finding quantities of tobacco as far south as Madras.  The southern Indian tobacco did find its way to the Sind area and Goa, however, the bulk of the southern export product was transported to Achin in Sumatra and thence into Java.

Also of note is that with the English occupation of Bombay (now Mbai) after 1665 resulted in an explosion of tobacco revenues accruing to the English in that area.

Of possible interest to Bahama and readers interested in the Indian artifacts he was gracious enough to present for our viewing are the comments of historian B.G. Gokhale on the influence of tobacco on other aspects of Indian industry.  Dr. Gokhale writes:

Tobacco also stimulated two other industries, metalware and pottery.  The two principal means of smoking tobacco were the hookah and the chilim.  The hookah is an elaborate contraption in three parts.  One is the metal bowl which acts as the tobacco burner and perches atop the stem connecting it with the other part, a metal bowel filled wit water.  Finally there is the stiff or flexible tubing surmounted with a mouthpiece through which the smoke is drawn from the top of the bowel and through the water container.  The aristocrats fancied highly-worked and decorated metal bowels and water containers which provided employment for the hundreds of metal workers.  The aristocrats also sported decorated metal boxes which held tobacco plugs in satisfactory moisture.  These became additional items for the metal and jewelry workers to manufacture.  The poorer folk used burners and water-bowels of clay from which the more plebeian chilim was also made.  The chilim was a short pipe with a wide opening, a tapering cylindrical body with a narrow mouthpiece which was covered with a cloth while smoking.  Thousands of such chilims provided an additional business for the potter [end quote]

Thus, during the 17th century between the reigns of the Moghal emperors Jahangir 1605-1627) and Aurangzeb (1658-1707) � whose reign would be of particular interest to Bahama � tobacco cultivation and smoking wrought a massive transformation on the material culture of India and the utilitarian objects surrounding the culture of tobacco use.

I have uploaded a portrait of Aurangzeb and a very fine example of an Islamic hookah bottle from the 18th century to illustrate the level of metalwork characteristic of such objects used by the elite classes of Moghal society.

I would love to write on B-7 and have a post on south Indian bronze and lost-wax casting ready to go if it is of any interest.  I heartily agree with Bart that B-7 is a very well executed bronze cast using the lost-wax method and clay forms.

I would very much benefit from Administration�s intent to share the Benin post with HH and will put in a vote in strong favor of that.

My computer will be up and running on Saturday, much to my relief.

Work consulted for these comments:

B. G. Gokhale
Tobacco in Seventeenth-Century India
Agricultural History, Vol. 48, No. 4. (Oct., 1974), pp. 484-492.


Best Regards,

Lubby

[bahamawrecker]

Thanks Bart for the feedback.
The site being in the protected water of a harbor and shallow, it presents little problems for the divers, except of the mud. Any little disturbance produces a great cloud of mud that reduces the visibility. This gives a robot little chance. For a diver, it takes some time to learn how to avoid stirring up the mud and how to work in spite of the reduced visibility. It becomes more of a feeling matter than a seeing matter.

Lubby,
Fantastic research, many thanks. Please continue with your very useful contributions. I think you are on the right track. There appears to be a strong Indian connection.

Administration,
thanks for the feedback. I would love to see more information about African bronze casting, since it seems that we have a part of the artifacts coming from Africa.

Again many thanks for all the help

Bahamawrecker
 

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Bart, Bahama, and Administration,

In the face of Bahama�s increased posting of artifacts and my own small technical problem, we advanced without discussing B2, the fluted cylindrical container.  While I was again astonished to see that you found a bronze or copper alloy Indian statue, it is still worth discussing the utilitarian brass objects (B1 and B2) a bit before moving onto the very beautiful and dramatic (B7).  Keep in mind that these comments only pertain to the lost-wax process utilized in the artistic traditions of Asia and Oceania.

B1 and B2 allow the comparison of two examples of the container metalwork present in Bahama�s assemblage, it has already been suggested that the method by which these objects were formed was through lost-wax casting.  It has also been observed that B7 was produced using the same process.  However, while there is a general similarity in process between these three pieces, there is an equally great divergence with respect to craftsmanship and technique.  B1 has been the subject of several posts, so these observations will start with B2, the fluted hinged cylinder. 

The really interesting characteristic of this artifact, at least from one point of view, is that its form represents a synthesis of one of the most basic and elemental shapes found in lost-wax (cire perdue) casting in almost every area of the world where cultures practice this art.  This basic shape is that of the bell.  In the case of B2, the object�s design appears to have resulted from casting and combining two bell-shaped pieces and hinging them together.  B2 also possesses some distinctive clasp loops that evoke basic but rigorously practiced lost-wax technique.

Here is a brief field report excerpted from American ethnographer Fay-Cooper Cole�s observations of the traditional lost-wax casting techniques practiced on the island of Mindanao.  Cole was an assistant curator of Malayan ethnology and had accompanied the  R. F. Cummings Philippine expedition (1906-1909).  I have included Cole�s figures from the 1913 published report of the expedition that show the steps of constructing casts for small brass or copper bells.  Of particular interest is the form of the hooks or loops which appear similar in some respects to those present on Bahama�s (B2) artifact.

Cole:

Among the men, as with the women, certain industries are monopolized by a few individuals. In this community no men stand higher in the estimation of their fellows than do the smiths and the casters of copper. The writer spent many hours watching I-o, the brass and copper worker of Cibolan, while he shaped bells, bracelets, and betel boxes at his forge on the outskirts of the village (Plate XXVII). Feathered plungers, which worked up and down in two bamboo cylinders, forced air through a small clay-tipped tube into a charcoal fire. This served as a bellows, while a small cup made of straw ashes formed an excellent crucible. The first day I watched I-o, he was making bells. Taking a ball of wax the size of a bucket shot, he put it on the end of a stick (Fig. 26a), and over this moulded the form of a bell in damp ashes obtained from rice straw (b). When several bells were thus fashioned they were dipped in melted wax and were turned on a leaf until smooth, after which an opening was cut through the wax at the bottom of each form (c). Strips of wax were rolled out and laid in shallow grooves which had been cut in the sides of the bells and were pressed in, at intervals, with a small bamboo knife (d). The top stick was then withdrawn, leaving an opening down to the wax ball inside. Into this hole a thin strip of wax was inserted and was doubled back on itself so as to form a hanger (e). For three days the forms were allowed to harden and were covered with several coats of damp straw ashes. Finally they were laid in a bed of the same material with a thin strip of wax leading from each bell to a central core (f). [FIG. 26] The whole, with the exception of the top of the central wax strip, was covered with a thick coating of damp ashes, and when this had hardened pieces of copper, secured from broken gongs, were placed in the crucible, melted and poured into the open end of the clay form. The molten metal took the place of the wax as it was dissolved and flowed to all parts where it had been. After being dropped in water the form was broken open, revealing six nearly perfect little bells which were ready for use as soon as the ashes were removed from them. The same method was used for all other casting. Clay forms were made as desired, were covered with wax, and the final coating of ashes applied before the casting. The workers in copper and brass are under the care and guidance of a spirit, Tolus ka towangan, for whom they make a yearly ceremony, Gomek towangan.

[I have uploaded Cole's illustration of the Davao clay bell mould as well as a detail of the forming of the wax bell shapes below]

Cole�s notation of I-O�s method describes the lost wax casting practice of a tribal group who appear to have retained their indigenous technique and customary forms with little or no outside cultural influence. The bells fashioned by I-O on Mindanao are basic and their outer surface is smooth and without decorative motif.  Bahama�s pieces represent something altogether different, although much of the basic technique is the same.

B2, if cast from the lost wax process, is the result of a technique more advanced but founded upon the methodology recorded by Cole.  Given that B1 and B2 were produced by shaping wax and creating a clay mould around this wax model, the ultimate cast metal object tells art historians and archaeologists a great deal about the artisan�s (and perhaps the culture�s) approach to clay modeling.  Of key importance is whether the clay model shows signs of incised or relief work in the execution of design motif.  Scholars continue to debate this subject, however, the basic line of approach is that cultures with a strong tradition of carving or working stone favor relief designs in the motifs related to decorating the clothing and other details found in the clay mold.  Conversely, cultures with a strong tradition working in ceramic arts tend to favor incised decorative motifs in the clay mould used for lost-wax casting.   Much of this relief vs. incised debate has dealt with the classification of the high-end bronze casting related to objects like B7.  Not much work appears to have been done with classifying utilitarian objects.  I have some reservations about the general points made above, particularly in the case of India and Southeast Asia where artisans from different social levels and cultural areas often worked within the same urban setting or geographical region.  Caution should be the watchword.  Nevertheless, here is an excerpt from a discussion on the International Gupta style and its relevance to the underlying clay technique found in the lost-wax moulds.

Sherman E. Lee, a scholar of Javanese art, believes that the tendency to utilize incised decorative patterns in lost wax casting is a trait characteristic of southern India and the Indonesian archipelago.  Lee�s comments are focused on the high-end bronze casting associated with Buddhist and Hindu statuary.  Objects as small and as utilitarian as Bahama�s appear to have not received the same level of scholarly attention.  However, what Lee goes on to write may have general importance to our topic:
These characteristics [incised decoration and plasticity]�are related to modeling in clay rather than carving in stone, and are arrived at not only because the original modeling was done in a wax or clay medium, but through the influence of a terracotta style found over much of the geographic area with which we are concerned [Java] (Lee, p. 277).

So when analyzing Bahama�s B1 and B2 artifacts, it is immediately apparent that B1, our tobacco associated container, follows an incised decorative technique in the crafting of the original clay mold, B2, with its fundamental two-bells form, also appears to rely on incised motif in order to create its fluted design.  This decorative approach to the preparation of the clay moulds for B1 and B2 differs significantly from the technique employed the maker of B7�s clay mould.

These are, of course, comments made at first blush, and the very nature of these artifacts makes classification difficult, but these are some characteristics to bear in mind as Bahama�s finds begin to speak.  B7 is unusually interesting in this regard and I hope a post on that artifact will be welcome.  Also, the above post is not an attempt to assign a specific geographic provenance to the artifacts; only a discussion of artistic techniques and influences.

Works consulted for these comments:

FAY-COOPER COLE
Assistant Curator of Malayan Ethnology

THE WILD TRIBES OF DAVAO DISTRICT, MINDANAO

FIELD MUSEUM OF NATURAL HISTORY.
PUBLICATION 170. ANTHROPOLOGICAL SERIES VOL. XII, No. 2.
The R. F. Cummings Philippine Expedition
GEORGE A. DORSEY Curator, Department of Anthropology CHICAGO, U. S. A.
September, 1913

Sherman E. Lee
An Early Javanese Bronze, the Gupta International Style and Clay Technique Artibus Asiae, Vol. 19, No. 3/4. (1956), pp. 271-278.

Best Regards,
Lubby

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Administration, Bart, and Bahama,

Here are a few thoughts on the B7 Shiva.

B7: When I first viewed the post containing this image I could scarcely believe it. Bahama appears to have recovered a Nandiswara Shiva effigy from a Caribbean shipwreck site.  I agree with Bart that the sculpture is cast using the cire perdue (lost-wax) technique and Bart is quite right to focus attention of the accoutrements and fashion adorning the bronze  (copper alloy) figure.

So far away from its original context and perhaps mixed within a collection of other artifacts from the Indian subcontinent, any final identification will have to await the study of a specialist.

It appears that the following observations can be put forward however.  First the artifact likely represents an aspect of the Hindu deity Shiva in his aspect of Nandiswara (Shiva rider of the bull Nandi).  In Hindu iconography, this aspect of Shiva is rendered with matted unadorned (without headdress) hair, almost bare but for a dhoti and hip belt.  This is quite a contrast with the iconography governing the portrayal of other aspects of Shiva, one of the most well-known in the West being the Nataraja Shiva form (Lord of the Dance).  B7, representing a Nandiswara Shiva, served to present Shiva as the perfect householder. Usually these Nandiswara Shiva bronzes appeared in groups, on Shiva�s right, his hand would rest on the bull Nandi.  To Shiva�s left would stand the figure of his consort Parvati, the embodiment of ideal feminine beauty.  Thus, if B7 were part of a Nandiswara Shiva group, there is a possibility that another bronze or two may lie within the wreck site.  The first image uploaded represents a Hindu ratha devoted to Nandiswara Shiva and illustrates the positioning of Shiva flanked by Nandi to the left and consort couples (Parvati?) to the right.  This ratha dates from the Chola period and is located at present day Mamallapuram on India�s southeast coast (this city appears on 17th century charts as Masulapatan).

Thus, on the basis of this and other examples, the artistic and iconographic influence from which B7 draws its inspiration may be traced to south India�s Chola Kingdom (897-1250 CE). The Chola state was deeply devoted to Shiva worship and numerous temples devoted to that deity are found in the Kavaeri River basin and extending throughout the areas dominated by the Chola.  The second image uploaded is a very famous Chola bronze attributed to the 11th century CE.  It was recovered at Thanjavur (Tanjore) and presently resides at the Rajaraja Museum.  Thanjavur, located on the Kaveri River, served as the capitol of the Chola state during the height of its power.  In this image, a masterpiece of Chola bronze work, the Nandiswara Shiva aspect is represented.  The pose of Shiva, the positioning of the hands and feet, the adornment and hairstyle, as well as the dhoti clothing Shiva, are echoed in the much later B7 piece.  Image two is a detail of the Thanjavur Shiva torso.

In the execution and style of work, however, B7 departs dramatically from the aquiline lines and proportions of the Chola bronze.  This is particularly true with respect to B7�s representation of the hands, which appear larger in proportion to the rest of the body.  In this respect, the style of B7 may be more closely related to regional elements that asserted themselves in the post-Chola period.  With the collapse of the Chola state in the 13th century CE, several post-Chola Hindu kingdoms emerged, notably the In Vijaynagar (14th to 16th century), there was an eclectic fusion of stylistic inputs derived from previous Southern dynasties. A particularly interesting development was the Srisailam temple (central Andhra 14th-15th C) all of whose carvings, in comparison with Chola forms, display a more regional or folkish style of rendering forms (one characteristic to note is that the proportion of the hands to the body become slightly larger in Vijaynagar works). A combined force of Islamic Sultanates annihilated the Vijaynagar army in 1565, and thereafter, southeast Indian history enters into a very confusing period that HH might discuss at a later date.  However, there continued to be small Hindu successor states to the Vijaynagar Kingdom.  Most notably the Tanjore and Madori Nayaks and then the Marathas, also Hindu, conquered Thanjavur (Tanjore) in 1674.  It was the Marathas who controlled this area of India at the time that Bahama�s vessel is presumed to have sailed.

Works consulted for these comments:

The Sculpture of Greater India
Aschwin Lippe
The Metropolitan Museum of Art Bulletin, New Series, Vol. 18, No. 6. (Feb., 1960), pp. 177-192.

Shiva Nataraja: Shifting Meanings of an Icon
Padma Kaimal
The Art Bulletin, Vol. 81, No. 3. (Sep., 1999), pp. 390-419.

Rajaraja Museum, Thanjavur

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Administration]

Hello all,
Here is a little something on the Portuguese and India.


European settlements in India 1501-1739

Portuguese India

Early history

The first Portuguese encounter with India was on May 20, 1498 when Vasco da Gama landed in Calicut (present-day Kozhikode). Over the objections of Arab merchants, da Gama secured an ambiguous letter of concession for trading rights from the Zamorin, Calicut's local ruler, but had to sail off without warning after the Zamorin insisted on his leaving behind all his goods as collateral. Gama kept his goods, but left behind a few Portuguese with orders to start a trading post.

In 1510, Portuguese admiral Afonso de Albuquerque defeated the Bijapur sultans on behalf of a local sovereign, Timayya, leading to the establishment of a permanent settlement in Velha Goa (or Old Goa). The Southern Province, also known simply as Goa, was the headquarters of Portuguese India, and seat of the Portuguese viceroy who governed the Portuguese possessions in Asia.

The Portuguese acquired several territories from the Sultans of Gujarat: Daman (occupied 1531, formally ceded 1539); Salsette, Bombay, and Ba�aim (occupied 1534); and Diu (ceded 1535). These possessions became the Northern Province of Portuguese India, which extended almost 100 km along the coast from Daman to Chaul, and in places 30�50 km inland. The province was ruled from the fortress-town of Ba�aim. Bombay (present day Mumbai) was given to Britain in 1661 as part of the Portuguese Princess Catherine of Braganza's dowry to Charles II of England. Most of the Northern Province was lost to the Marathas in 1739, and Portugal acquired Dadra and Nagar Haveli in 1779.

The Goa Inquisition

The Portuguese set up a long program to convert the native population (mainly Hindus) by torture. It was much larger and endured for a longer period than the Spanish Inquisition. Thousands of citizens suffered horrors and execution and led to large portions of Goa being depopulated (See Goa Inquisition[1][2]). Eventually, the Inquisition in Goa was banished in 1812 by royal decree, as a consequence of Napoleon's Iberian Peninsular campaign.

References
   1. The Portuguese Inquisition in Goa (1560-1812)
   2. Kanchan Gupta, "Recall the Goa Inquisition to stop the Church from crying foul"

Thanjavur Nayaks



Wars with Portugal

Portugal controlled the Nagapattinam territory as well as the Colombo province in Ceylon and the entire West Coast of India. The King of Jaffna went into a war against Portugal against the methods adopted by the missionary conversions in Jaffna. Later King of Jaffna sought help from the Tanjore Nayaks in repelling Portuguese advances through many battles.


A Mighty Cannon of forge-welded Iron. This cannon was built during the reign of Raghunatha Nayak (1600 - 1645 CE), and it was located at the defense barricade at the Eastern entrance to the city.

Maratha conquest

Chokkanatha placed his brother Alagiri on the throne of Thanjavur, but within a year the latter threw off his allegiance, and Chokkanatha was forced to recognise the independence of Thanjavur. A son of Vijaya Raghava induced the Bijapur Sultan to help his get back the Thanjavur throne. In 1675, the Sultan of Bijapur sent a force commanded by the Maratha general Venkaji (alias Ekoji) to drive away the Madurai usurper. Venkaji defeated Alagiri with ease, and occupied Thanjavur. He did not, however, place his protege on the throne as instructed by the Bijapur Sultan, but seized the kingdom and made himself king. Thus ended the reign of Nayaks and the start of Maratha power in Thanjavur.

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Administration,

Thank you for this wonderfully clear and accurate summary of a deliciously intricate piece of south Indian political history. Very nice to set Bahama's artifacts against this context.

Best Regards,

Lubby

[Tayopa]

HOLA  Fascinating reading, loved it.  A side thingie, just how long was that canon?

Jesus, I enjoyed you post greatly.

Don Jose de La Mancha

[bahamawrecker]

Thanks to all, for the great follow-up.
 I have not much time these days, but here is one more picture from the same site.  This is a very different context.  I think I have mentioned above, that two ships sank at the same time. They were coming from different places but sank in the same happening.
Bahamawrecker

[Jesus of Lubeck]

Hello Tayopa,

Very pleased to make your acquaintance and thank you for your comments.  I am still new to the forum and hope to get around to your neck of the woods soon.

Hello Bahama,

Are you able to report what material the bottle is constructed from?  I would like to know if it is ceramic or glass?  If it is ceramic, may we politely impose on your crew for a closeup of the ceramic form that clearly shows the color and texture of the ceramic paste?

Best Regards,

Lubby

[bahamawrecker]

Hi Lubby,

The bottle is made out of glass.  I have found similar bottles on other shipwrecks from the same time period. The glas is always very corroded and flakey, I suspect that it is due to the quality of the glass itself.
Bahamawrecker