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History's Hinge - 'Ain Jalut

[arany]

Aye,

so it's just the wee device to the right of the cross, correct? What I find confusing is that the shield, better we call it the coat of arms, on coins from Granada and Seville differ. Since these coins were not dated the only clue we have to go on is the devices used to even be close to the time. By your leave, I have posted the coin to Don MacKay in hopes that he might help us with the history.
Cheers,
Doc

No, Doc, the coin is not rare or confusing. This shield design was used for many years. Just a bit early for me in my knowledge of cob design.  I agree that the compressed cross in the upper right section of the shield could be Jerusalem, as it is the same as the Jerusalem cross that was commonly used on the reverse of the coins.
   To see the variety of coin design, take a look at the coin photo I've attached.  When Carlos I opened the first mint in the New World in Mexico in 1535, they issued reales with a completely different design called the "pillars & waves" design. And even this design which was used under other kings as well, can be found in many variations. And of course another whole story behind the elements in the 'Pillars & Waves'. Oh, how we could go on! 
  This is precisely why cobs are so fascinating. So many designs, such differences in quality. Land finds, shipwreck finds - exciting!
  moneypenny

2 reales mexico (carlos) is one of the most and beter reproduced...los dos reales de mexico (carlos) es uno de las monedas lo mas y mejor falsificados  arany

[Born2Dtect]

Here is my Spanish cob coin I found while metal detecting. I was found recently in a farm field on the Eastern Shore of Maryland. The coin weighs 1.95 grams and is about 16 X17 mm. Because of the size and weight I believe it to be a 1 reale. I Also believe it is a shield type. If anyone can add to this, possibly with a date range I would appreciate it.

Thanks,

Ed Donovan

[moneypenny]

Welcome to History Hunters Born2Dtect,   Hope you enjoy participating here.  You seem to be fairly knowledgeable yourself about Cob coinage judging from the vocabulary you use in reference to your coin.  It is difficult with these small denominations to find much information in what's visible on the strike.   I will look into the details further tomorrow, but right now I will say that I am probably going to agree with you that it is a 1 real, and it appears it might be from the Potosi mint.  The photos you have included are excellent quality and show the coin on it's side. Each photo could be rotated counter-clockwise to view the shield and cross upright.
   16 mm is very small, a bit smaller than a US dime, and under 2 grams weight is very light, even for a 1 real.  Since 8 reales weighed in at about 27 grams, a 1 real can weigh over 3 grams, or one-eighth the weight of an 8 reales. But of course they are rarely found complete.
   I haven't offered you much information about dating your coin. This is more difficult. 
   Eastern Shore Maryland is a rather interesting place to find a cob. The story of how it got there might be fascinating in itself. 
   I'll try to find out more for you. Meanwhile, if we have any coin experts out there, please help us out.  Thanks.    Moneypenny

[Diving Doc]

Very Good Moneypenny!

I found the weight to be confusing. I had thought it might be a half-real but it has almost a full shield. We had some halves a bit earlier and of course the 'scalloped' cross might make it a Potosi coin as you suggested.
Cheers,
Doc

[Administration]

Hello Born2Dtect and welcome to History Hunters   

That is a very nice find you have there. I look forward to seeing more.

[moneypenny]

   Here's a bit more information that may help narrow down the identification of this coin.   For now I am going to assume this is a coin from the Potosi mint, one of the new world's most prolific mints as we've discussed in this thread in the past.  The Lima and Cartagena mints also used this style of cross, but those coins are much rarer.
   The style of the shield is the best help for narrowing down a time period.  This is a Hapsburg shield and Carlos II was the last Hapsburg king of Spain, ruling up until 1700. So that puts us prior to that date. We also know that Potosi switched to a Pillars & Waves design in 1652, so that narrows it further.  The Potosi mint began in 1574, so we have come down to a 75 yr. period. (1574-1652).  If a date was visible, that would help because Potosi coins prior to 1617 were undated. In this case, on a coin this small, seeing a date, even if it was originally there, is rare. 
    In viewing earlier posts on this thread you will find photos of various coin styles.  Some of these will allow you see how the designs look when they are clear and complete. 
    Sorry I can't be more specific.  I was hoping we had some visitors who are more expert than myself to help out.   Good luck with your coin hunting, Born2Dtect!       
moneypenny   

[Diving Doc]

many years I have lot of examples of similar fakes made in antigua guatemala  so  with the micriscope possible to see marks of lost wax technique

Arany,
could you post some pictures of examples of the counterfits you are discussing.
It would be most helpful to our members.
Cheers,
Doc

[Diving Doc]

Great finds! What camera did you use to take the photo of the coins, it shows great detail. I have some that if I could get the right shot (as clear as yours) then I could post them.
Again very, very lucky man, watch those GW`s. Don't believe they wont bite because you have a tinny on your back. 99*

PS, Not insulting you by saying you are just lucky. By what I've seen, you're very good at hunting.

Hey 99,
Grubby was using the camera I sent him, a SD-100 Power shot. It is an older model but you can still get a waterproof housing for it. I sent that to Grubby as well. It will be interesting to see his u/w shots in the Spring when the seas go down.  When I get down to dive with you I will be bring my Casio EX-S600 with u/w case. These cameras are so neat and small you can stuff it in a BC pocket and the flash works under water as well. The very best part is that you can shoot video with the camera with a 1 or 2 Gig chip. Remember how bulky and u/w video used to be? This fits in one hand!!
Cheers,
Doc

[arany]

 yes is very important to compare, lamentably today I don have a pictures, maybe later I can fainded sameting..... si es muy importante para comparar, pero no tengo fotos para publicar, talvez un dia sea posible , la calidad de las monedas falsas de antigua guatemala son exelentes, tambien los  centenarios  monedas de oro de mexico son falsificados de oro muy bajo quilate y chapeados del oro puro, exelentes reproducciones !

[Diving Doc]

I agree Arany,
It would be very good to see these examples posted along side real coins to educate the membership.
Cheers,
Doc

[arany]

than you  doc  is very important  the best way o meybe the only way to compare  is take a picture and the negativ film (large size) superpose bout negativs to see the diference betven good coin and fake coin... la mejor forma de comparar las monedas falsas con los originales, es de tomat foto y los negativos (tamano grande) comparar superponer contra la luz para veer la diferencia...arany