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History's Hinge - 'Ain Jalut

[Fleamistress]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7029513.stm

[Bart]

Greetings all;

Here is the entire story from Cyn's link;

Vatican book on Templars' demise

Friday, 5 October 2007

The Vatican is to publish a book which is expected to shed light on the demise of the Knights Templar, a Christian military order from the Middle Ages.



The book is based on a document known as the Chinon parchment, found in the Vatican Secret Archives six years ago after years of being incorrectly filed.

The document is a record of the heresy hearings of the Templars before Pope Clement V in the 14th Century.

The official who found the paper says it exonerates the knights entirely.

Prof Barbara Frale, who stumbled across the parchment by mistake, says that it lays bare the rituals and ceremonies over which the Templars were accused of heresy.

In the hearings before Clement V, the knights reportedly admitted spitting on the cross, denying Jesus and kissing the lower back of the man proposing them during initiation ceremonies.

However, many of the confessions were obtained under torture and knights later recanted or tried to claim that their initiation ceremony merely mimicked the humiliation the knights would suffer if they fell into the hands of the Muslim leader Saladin.

The leader of the order, Jacques de Moley, was one of those who confessed to heresy, but later recanted.

He was burned at the stake in Paris in 1314, the same year that the Pope dissolved the order.

However, according to Prof Frale, study of the document shows that the knights were not heretics as had been believed for 700 years.

In fact she says "the Pope was obliged to ask for pardons from the knights... the document we have found absolves them".

Details of the parchment will be published as part of Processus contra Templarios, a book that will be released by the Vatican's Secret Archive on 25 October.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7029513.stm

How nice that the Vatican is to publish a book and make (more) money after a 700 year old 'mis-filing', as they would have us believe of their treachery today. It has only taken them 700 years to catch up with what the vast majority of us has believed all along. And now we must wait and wonder what other history is going to be changed after 700 or more years. Exactly what is the point of revealing and announcing this at this time? Is this a concession by the Vatican that the Pope is no longer infallible? Or did just this one Pope made a tiny mistake 700 years ago. As they robbed the Templars ages ago, they will rob them once more by selling the admission of their own errors? This is no way to ask for a soul's pardon. What utter nonsense if this is expected to be believed by any thinking person.

I just love this line... "However, according to Prof Frale, study of the document shows that the knights were not heretics as had been believed for 700 years. " Believed? By whom? Those few who were ordered to believe by the Vatican?

This one is also classic...  "the Pope was obliged to ask for pardons from the knights... the document we have found absolves them".   How nice after 700 years, just how does such benefit anyone? Or is this some form of catholic necrophilia? It certainly cannot be described as 'setting the record straight', most of the world then, and since then have known this all along. Isn't it about time this insidious and despicable institution disbanded itself, or helped along that road by other concerned parties?

At the very least, their 'secret' library ought to be brought to light, organized, and publicly and freely disseminated so it doesn't take another 700 years or more for 'mistakes' to come to light. What hath the 'light of the world' religion a need for a secret library in the first place? Or must history be corrected and sold piece-meal by incident of each correction? The focus appears not to be correcting history, truth, or any other good thing, but as always with this bunch, making money.

Does this mean that after 700 years, the soul's of these poor, wronged knights have been released from Hell by the current Pontiff? I don't see that aspect of the situation mentioned in the article, perhaps it was a mere oversight, or something got mis-filed again. Does "I beg your pardon" negate 700 years of torture in Hell? If the ceremonies were performed to correct the past "mistakes", were they spoken in Latin, a language which only a few outside of the Vatican can even understand? Somehow that doesn't seem to be vey consoling to the wronged, damned, dead innocents.

Bart

[scribe]

The Knights Templar

[Fleamistress]

Dear Bart,

I think you should send your comments as a letter to relevant newspapers and magazines.

Your Pal,

Cyn

[Bart]

Well Cyn, some of it was tongue in cheek to point out the silliness of the whole concept involved there. So many have been fooled by that outfit, and willingly, mind you, that submitting it to a paper would be pointless. Nothing is going to change anytime soon anyway, so I'll just rant when the urge wells up.

Bart

[Bart]

Knights Templar Win Heresy Reprieve After 700 Years

By Philip Pullella - Fri Oct 12, 4:10 AM ET

VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - The Knights Templar, the medieval Christian military order accused of heresy and sexual misconduct, will soon be partly rehabilitated when the Vatican publishes trial documents it had closely guarded for 700 years.

   A reproduction of the minutes of trials against the Templars, "'Processus Contra Templarios -- Papal Inquiry into the Trial of the Templars"' is a massive work and much more than a book -- with a 5,900 euros ($8,333

US) price tag.

   "This is a milestone because it is the first time that these documents are being released by the Vatican, which gives a stamp of authority to the entire project," said Professor Barbara Frale, a medievalist at the Vatican's Secret Archives.

   "Nothing before this offered scholars original documents of the trials of the Templars," she told Reuters in a telephone interview ahead of the official presentation of the work on October 25.

   The epic comes in a soft leather case that includes a large-format book including scholarly commentary, reproductions of original parchments in Latin, and -- to tantalize Templar buffs -- replicas of the wax seals used by 14th-century inquisitors.

   Reuters was given an advance preview of the work, of which only 799 numbered copies have been made.

    One parchment measuring about half a meter wide by some two meters long is so detailed that it includes reproductions of stains and imperfections seen on the originals.

   Pope Benedict will be given the first set of the work, published by the Vatican Secret Archives in collaboration with Italy's Scrinium cultural foundation, which acted as curator and will have exclusive world distribution rights.

   The Templars, whose full name was "Poor Fellow-Soldiers of Christ and of the Temple of Solomon," were founded in 1119 by knights sworn to protecting Christian pilgrims visiting the Holy Land after the Crusaders captured Jerusalem in 1099.

   They amassed enormous wealth and helped finance wars of some European monarchs. Legends of their hidden treasures, secret rituals and power have figured over the years in films and bestsellers such as "The Da Vinci Code."

   The Knights have also been portrayed as guardians of the legendary Holy Grail, the cup used by Christ at the Last Supper before his crucifixion.

   The Vatican expects most copies of the work to be bought up by specialized libraries at top universities and by leading medieval scholars.

BURNED AT THE STAKE

   The Templars went into decline after Muslims re-conquered the Holy Land at the end of the 13th century and were accused of heresy by King Philip IV of France, their foremost persecutor. Their alleged offences included denying Christ and secretly worshipping idols.

   The most titillating part of the documents is the so-called Chinon Parchment, which contains phrases in which Pope Clement V absolves the Templars of charges of heresy, which had been the backbone of King Philip's attempts to eliminate them.

   Templars were burned at the stake for heresy by King Philip's agents after they made confessions that most historians believe were given under duress.

   The parchment, also known as the Chinon Chart, was "misplaced" in the Vatican archives until 2001, when Frale stumbled across it.

    "The parchment was catalogued incorrectly at some point in history. At first I couldn't believe my eyes. I was incredulous," she said. "This was the document that a lot of historians were looking for," the 37-year-old scholar said.

   Philip was heavily indebted to the Templars, who had helped him finance his wars, and getting rid of them was a convenient way of cancelling his debts, some historians say.

   Frale said Pope Clement was convinced that while the Templars had committed some grave sins, they were not heretics.

SPITTING ON THE CROSS

   Their initiation ceremony is believed to have included spitting on the cross, but Frale said they justified this as a ritual of obedience in preparation for possible capture by Muslims. They were also said to have practiced sodomy.

   "Simply put, the pope recognized that they were not heretics but guilty of many other minor crimes -- such as abuses, violence and sinful acts within the order," she said. "But that is not the same as heresy."

    Despite his conviction that the Templars were not guilty of heresy, in 1312 Pope Clement ordered the Templars disbanded for what Frale called "the good of the Church" following his repeated clashes with the French king.

   Frale depicted the trials against the Templars between 1307 and 1312 as a battle of political wills between Clement and Philip, and said the document means Clement's position has to be reappraised by historians.

   "This will allow anyone to see what is actually in documents like these and deflate legends that are in vogue these days," she said.

   Rosi Fontana, who has helped the Vatican coordinate the project, said: "The most incredible thing is that 700 years have passed and people are still fascinated by all of this."

   "The precise reproduction of the parchments will allow scholars to study them, touch them, admire them as if they were dealing with the real thing," Fontana said.

   "But even better, it means the originals will not deteriorate as fast as they would if they were constantly being viewed," she said.

[Fleamistress]

In the above:
" Despite his conviction that the Templars were not
guilty of heresy, in 1312 Pope Clement ordered the
Templars disbanded for what Frale called "the good
of the Church" following his repeated clashes with
the French king."

Could it mean:

"At the Council of Vienne in 1312, Pope Clement tried
another strategy by formally terminating the Templars'
chivalric status in an attempt to have de Molay and
the other prisoners handed over to the papal curia for
a more comfortable house arrest. By this means,
he figured that an official trial could be conducted under
his jurisdiction, and that the Knights would be reprieved
in due course."

It could mean that. 

It would be helpful when quoting to identify the source.

And it would be helpful to me if you can elaborate on your pithy comment above:  "Interesting statements."

Cyn

[Fleamistress]

Knights Templar Win Heresy Reprieve After 700 Years

By Philip Pullella - Fri Oct 12, 4:10 AM ET

VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - The Knights Templar, the medieval Christian military order accused of heresy and sexual misconduct, will soon be partly rehabilitated when the Vatican publishes trial documents it had closely guarded for 700 years.

   A reproduction of the minutes of trials against the Templars, "'Processus Contra Templarios -- Papal Inquiry into the Trial of the Templars"' is a massive work and much more than a book -- with a 5,900 euros ($8,333

US) price tag.

 

Dear Bart,

Hour being what it is in EST'ville, I glazed over right there.

But I'm alert enough to ask if you will buy me a copy for Christmas.  Pretty please? 

[Bart]

Cyn, I checked the piggy bank and couldn't find any Euros in it. If any turn up in it betwixt now and then, I would most assuredly consider it, but don't hold your breath. I will send you another book that is just as interesting, '101 Things You Can Do With Dead Cats'.

Bart

[Fleamistress]

Is it me or is there a preponderance of Catholics here?

Meanwhile, Quantrill33, you have slipped and revealed a nugget of a sense of humor not evident until now.  I am so relieved.  Thank you for the links.  Who did what to whom and when I'll leave to the scholars, as all I can bring to the table is speculation and beer and it's a tad late for that.

And, Bart?  Thank you for the offer of an alternative book. I prefer that you donate it instead to a local elementary school as I am allergic to cats.

Cheers,

Cyn

[Fleamistress]

 Easier to smelt, my dear?

Cyn